I'm curious whether you have any thoughts on the Duffin-style of sumo. The ability to take a wider stance and remain upward with strong thoracic extension (Chest up) actually provides a lot of freedom and efficiency; while simultaneously improving posture and lower back strength. Mental cues: With conventional, you can think about pushing the floor away from you. Form matters and practice matters. Very heavy singles (over 85%) never did much for me, triples tend to be my mainstay over the years. That should be your grip width. A little bit of ROM cut goes a long way, and if you're much higher, form can change more and it might not carry over as well. Make certain you know what's going on and how to plan to fix your issues! Form is a huge component of sumo DLs. Yes it hurts. Instead of throwing in the towel on progress, let’s take a look at nine deadlift assistance exercises you can try to improve your deadlift. What didn't work: Burning myself out with deadlifting too often. Do you do your SPDL's conventional style or sumo style? People who switch from conventional often have too narrow of a stance. Credentials: 515 @ 185lbs from 365 @185lbs about 1.5 years ago. I definitely think training sumo works by going reasonably heavy reasonably frequently. You ever try wrestling shoes? You're not picking the bar up, you're driving the ground away. In conjuction with this, any top level comment that does not all provide credentials (pictures, or lifting numbers) will be removed. Take my word for it - I’ve had about fifty athletes complete this program, and all fifty will tell you this is all you need. Technical strength: an ideal sumo will be close in and upright. If shoulder mobility is an issue, you can use lifting straps, or you could just start stretching more. The overall upper back, hamstrings and glute activation is quite similar between the 3 variations. It’s a dead lift. Best single was 645@195, and I worked up to 585x5@205 just before my latest injury. Recovery from a torn hamstring is a painful and fairly lengthy procedure, and it would be nice to avoid that. Not trying to persuade, just curious. Don’t make that mistake. I usually use ~3". Top set of 500x3 touch and go at 210lbs a month ago (before the flu). I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. 405 was a monster of a plateau. If you do these at a steady tempo, and touch and go, you can focus on the feeling of maintaining your trunk position and getting into that ideal lockout position. For timing, I mean that ideally the first part of the pull should be knees extension to lockout with the hip angle fairly constant, then pushing the hips through to lockout. Deadlift the right way, you probably will after learning of deadlift benefits reddit amazing qualities, glutes, and I that. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Foot and knee angle: Point your toes slightly out, but point your knees out even moreso as you complete the lift, as if you're trying to open up your legs. Okay I'm a little late, but u/ZBGBs said I should do this so here I am! Idk if I'm weightroom worthy, but this is one of my favorite lifts so I wanted to jump in. We will be covering a variety of topics that covers all of the strength and physique sports, as well as a few additional topics. What worked: A lot of people have trouble with this lift, so they don't practice it. Most pull styles to me make perfect sense. I pull sumo, my best is an 821 lb/372.5 kg pull at a bodyweight of 225 lbs/102.3. My luck is that I have GIANT quads which translate well to doing heavy sumo pulls. 1 Deadlift + 1 RDL = 1 Rep Shred: 3 sets of 10 reps, rest 60 – 90 seconds between sets Bulk: 3 sets of 8 reps, rest 90 – 120 seconds between sets My 1RM sumo was a gym lift of 315lb at 120lb bodyweight (girl). Not sure what to do to "open the hips". But, since sumo and trap bar deadlifts are more squat-like than the conventional deadlift, they will actually emphasize the quadriceps a little more as a result. Do the bottom half of the movement twice per rep. One rep will involve pulling to the knee, then dropping back down to just off the floor, then lifting to completion. The sumo deadlift demands less ankle and thoracic spine mobility, as the torso is kept vertical (similar to a high-bar squat). Hip CARs, tempo split squats, pigeon pose, and just DL to knees with a plate to get stretched and comfortable in positioning. Do you mean keep your feet spread wider so that they are almost touching the weights? Stance: The first step in sumo is finding the right stance. I could hold maybe 550 mixed, but pull 7 plates (ish). For timing, another drill that I really like here is just a partial deadlift, up to around the knees. Getting my quads stronger through SSBs, pause squats, hack squats, and a ton of accessories was key! Conventional work. Firstly; the most obvious difference between a sumo squat and a regular squat is your foot position. Duffin, however, I just can't figure out. I'm at work so can't link but Brady Cable (who coincidentally coaches at Kabuki) also pulls this way, and I have similar leverages to him; ghoulishly long arms and legs. Press J to jump to the feed. This thread is a topic driven collective to fill the void that the more program oriented Tuesday thread has left. any stretches that have worked well for you? I’ve covered both topics in the linked articles, but I’m going to just give you a few mobility drills and stretches I have personally found helpful in getting into a better sumo deadlift position. The Belkin/Pozdeev style pull starts with much more static hips, but still has some stretch reflex. Sumo Deadlift + Trap Bar Deadlift = Greater Quadriceps Involvement. I've gotten stuck off the ground, at lockout, at mid knee! Most seniors and older folks are able to perform some variation of the deadlift and improve it significantly. For hip closeness, I've found that using different set ups as a drill is the most useful for me. The downside, at least for me, was an inconsistency of bar path. Serious question, though: how do you program that? Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns. The Sumo Deadlift, much like the wide-grip, arched competition Bench Press, is often ridiculed online for being a “cheater lift”, when in reality the Sumo Deadlift is a highly technical lift dependant upon leverages, mobility, and strength in the starting position.Being able to efficiently pull and stay within the proper positions is a skill in itself. That way you can drive through the floor and not get caught rounding and pulling a wide-stance conventional. I am currently programming with GZCL methodolgy. With this style, your hips are closer to the bar compared to a conventional deadlift with a more vertical torso, which takes the stress off of your lower back and places it on your legs. My go to hip mobility / flexibility drill for the sumo #Deadlift. level and then a massive one around 750). I think I need to work form at the bottom, and definitely strengthen my back side. Also foot placement helped drastically. Please don't say your triple bw is not that big! I frequently see room for improvement with more lifters than you think. While we value your involvement on the sub, we don't want to create a culture of the blind leading the blind. When you "[took] time off from doing deadlifts as a primary exercise" did you have any particular movements you prioritized that you noticed some carryover or at least enjoyed doing? Conventional for all warmups as heavy and as many as I can do of my sets/reps. What you want to do is stand wide enough so that your knee joint can form a 90° angle when you begin the lift. I would split my approach to sumo into three parts: form work, "technical" strength, "brute" strength. You don't want that either. Not getting feedback by others nor recording your sets to see what's happening is a bad habit to fall into! I didn't switch to it, but rather I found out when I started powerlifting that you couldn't use straps. The bar probably needs to start closer to your shins than you think. How wide you want to stand depends on your mobility and how strong you are in different positions. 2. It’s important to recognize that while the two deadlift styles look different there are two main similarities. My experience may be relevant here. lol I can barely do double. Cookies help us deliver our Services. My hips get trashed if I do all the sumo work I need to make progress in a single day. Do you have lile a separate conventional day or do you do blocks of one or the other? Everything you need to know about strength programming, barbell training, and the mental shifts need to deadlift 500+ pounds or more. When you say this, do you mean to get your ass lower when you're starting so that you have more leg drive at the bottom? Creds: IPL Drug Tested World Record, 300kg, and my most recent pulls @640 and 650 that were fast and sexy. Sometimes it even makes sense to take some time off from deadlifting in order to get better at it, so listen to your body and back off if needed. I'm seriously debating running RSP early next year and deadlifts will inherently be deprioritized as a result, but I'm also worried that I'll lose some poundage and have to fight to regain it. Use this as a place to ask the more advanced lifters, who have actually had plateaus, how they were able to get past them. Intensity is relatively important compared to conventional - I can't do 85-90+% week in and week out on conventional like I can sumo. Take a wide stance, place your shins roughly .5inch away from the bar, and angle your toes to follow the same line as your knees. By doing so the lifter is moved closer to the ground. Front squats are also great for learning to extend through the hips and knees with a rigid trunk, and the core/trunk stability strength is always useful. This helps so much because I get a lot of hip pain from pulling sumo and squatting heavy often, also keeps focus on back improvement versus primarily focusing on quads (they get plenty in other ways). The sumo deadlift can decrease vertical bar distance by as much as 10 percent. Constantly reviewing and improving technique, Going ham on t2 movements for pulling (weighted pullups, heavy BB rows, shrugs, deficit SLDL, and front squats). Practice practice practice. Hook grip. Let’s start by breaking the word. You set up, pull firmly/steadily with a focus on extending the knees, and end up with the bar around your knees with your knees locked. Todays topic of discussion: Sumo Deadlift. Look for shin positioning. The whole reason I switched was so I'd never have to pull stupid conventional again. Any issue is either off the ground (weak back/quads) or lockout (positioning, more on that below!). 3. Are you pulling back on the bar too fast and locking knees too early? Foot angle. Other notes: Stronger quads, abductors, glutes, and back helps. It's not hard to adapt and it makes it easier for me to handle frequency. I found that on any given day, I could pull 5 reps of 385 and not feel close to getting 1 at 405. Really working on my hip flexibility allowed my to get a better position closer to the bar and reduce my range of motion. Make sure your back is flexed and tight throughout the lift. Sumo has always been my preferred stance. Before we go into the sumo deadlift technique, let’s look at why you would do it. Getting my low back stronger, getting more direct work on the lats, using accessories/variations to target my weaker areas have all been things I've tried!